Some dudes--->Cleveland, some other dudes--->Mets, a whole bunch of dudes--->Seattle

by acblue on Dec 11, 2008 12:57 AM EST Comment 26 comments

Mets get:

J.J. Putz

Sean Green

Jeremy Reed

Indians get:

Joe Smith
Luis Valbuena

Mariners get:

Franklin Gutierrez

Endy Chavez

Aaron Heilman

Mike Carp

Maikel Cleto

Jason Vargas

Ezequiel Carrera

I'm obviously quite biased, but this seems like an everyone-wins sort of trade. The Mets bullpen is pretty ridiculous now, and Reed is a decent bench player. Cleveland gets a interesting 2B prospect and the most generically named player in the majors. The Mariners fill their hole in CF with a good young player, pick up a solid 4th OFer, replace Putz on the cheap and pick up a decent 1B prospect.

As an M's fan, I'm pretty excited. I don't love losing Valbuena because it makes selling high on Lopez less of a possibility, and I might have preferred a straight Putz-Joyce swap, but the M's OF defense has gone from abominable to the team's greatest strength in an instant. That might be damning them with faint praise, but whatever, let me be happy. I'd love to hear from Mets and Indians fans for their take on this one.

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Wow, Gutierrez AND Endy?

I don’t know anything about most of these prospects, but one year of Putz for some stuff that will be useful in the future seems pretty smart. Gutierrez is probably just as good as Reed overall. That OF will be sick defensively. Jarrod Washburn’s 2011 salary just increased by $5MM.

Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.

by Sky Kalkman on Dec 11, 2008 5:06 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Gutierrez is waaaaay better than Reed.

Endy and Reed is the straight swap; Reed has slightly better offense, Endy has better defense.

by acblue on Dec 11, 2008 10:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

"Gutierrez is probably just as good as Reed overall"

Whaaa? Better offense (+ upside) plus better defense equals “probably just as good?”

by JonBBT on Dec 14, 2008 3:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I don't know why I wrote that. Please don't hold it against me.

Maybe I meant Guierrez:Ibanez?

Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.

by Sky Kalkman on Dec 14, 2008 12:20 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Wrote what?

i’ve got your back

by JonBBT on Dec 14, 2008 6:18 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I like this trade for everyone but the Mets.

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by Kyle Boddy on Dec 12, 2008 5:27 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Really, why?

by Sokojoe on Dec 12, 2008 12:13 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

They gave up a whole mess of MiL depth, but I still think it's good for them.

They swap Chavez for Reed, upgrade from Smith to Green and take a slight risk on Putz. Even if Putz tanks they’re not out too much, and it’s not like they’re counting on him to be their relief ace.

by acblue on Dec 13, 2008 12:30 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

As a Mets fan

I love the trade. Heilman needed to go, and Endy only had limited value to us, especially with Willie no longer managing. I’m gonna miss Joe Smith, but it sounds like Green is more or less the same pitcher (though admittedly a few years older). And Putz gives us what we really, really needed the past 2 years: a set-up guy who generates missed swings and piles up K’s. I have a feeling he’s gonna be better than KRod, which could be interesting, to see if Manuel uses him in the Bill James “Relief Ace” role, which IMO would be fantastic.

by cjmulrain on Dec 13, 2008 12:30 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Green is great and underrated.

You’ll like him. If J.J.‘s 2008 can be chalked up to costochondritis and rust he should be a steal for y’all. If 2008 J.J. is what he is going forward, well…

by acblue on Dec 13, 2008 2:27 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Green wasn't the guy the Mets needed.

He’s collapsed down the stretch in each of the last two seasons. 11.70 ERA in August 08, 5.51 in 07. 7.71 in Sept 08, 5.73 in 07.

If the Mets don’t overwork him maybe he’ll be alright, but if I was a team trying not to fall apart down the stretch for the 3rd year in a row, Green isn’t the reliever I want.

by JonBBT on Dec 13, 2008 8:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

no

but both KRod and Putz are at their best in September. Career numbers:

KRod – 87.2 IP, 1.85 ERA, 131 K, 1.19 WHIP
Putz – 51.2 IP, 2.44 ERA, 64 K, 1.08 WHIP

And both were very, very good in September each of the past 2 seasons, which would have benefited the Mets greatly.

by cjmulrain on Dec 14, 2008 12:17 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I’m pretty sure the confidence variable has to be pretty damn large on predicting future one month performances based on past innings numbers you refer too.

by hans on Dec 14, 2008 2:25 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

but it's large

for the numbers jonbbt posted above?

by cjmulrain on Dec 14, 2008 12:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Thats completely true, its pretty much a pointless argument since there simply isn’t a large enough sample size to squeeze out the luck variance.

by hans on Dec 15, 2008 1:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I was definitely not talking about either of those two.

I was talking about Sean Green, and mentioned him twice.

???

by JonBBT on Dec 14, 2008 3:28 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I'm just saying

I don’t really think they’re relying on Sean Green to turn their bullpen around. His late-season performance is more or less irrelevant, they got Putz and KRod to solidify the bullpen. Green was a throw-in b/c they had to give up Joe Smith to Cleveland.

by cjmulrain on Dec 14, 2008 12:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs