How did Nate McLouth win a Gold Glove?
by philkid3 on Nov 5, 2008 6:08 PM EST
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PrintTo me, this makes the Jeter Gold Gloves look understandable. He was -40 in plus/minus this year. In the numbers Sky presented to us, he was worth -16 runs in the field. I've never heard of a reputation for him, I see no evidence anywhere for liking him.
How did he win? How? I know the Gold Glove is a joke, but there still has to be some reasoning.
Also: Albert Pujols gets robbed. Again. People really don't like him. And Brandon Phillips did to Chase Utley what Utley's partner did to Tulowitzki last year, so I'll call that Karma.
Finally: Can anyone give me evidence that Maddux really deserved this and didn't just win, again, on reputation?
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maybe this is just me
but who cares? we all know these things are often jokes. should we be surprised when it happens again?
My thoughts exactly
Mother---- him and John Wayne!
by MerryGoByeBye on Nov 6, 2008 1:05 AM EST up reply actions
Hey, anyone want to give odds that Mark Ellis finally wins one of the like five GGs he should have by now?
5%?
Less?
Your 2008 Athletics: It's Nothing Personal.
100% he wins it
the year after he retires
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by Matt Klaassen on Nov 5, 2008 7:46 PM EST up reply actions
Ellis will win
if/when he hits, or after he starts playing in a larger market…
"This is Rickey, calling on behalf of Rickey."
...and his glove drops to -5 or worse
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by Matt Klaassen on Nov 6, 2008 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
to be fair
he posted an update in which he says he pictures rolen in a cardinals uniform. As a cardinal fan who loves troy glaus, so do I.
the enemy's gate is down.
And to be fair to me
he posted that after I mocked him for it.
lol
I did assume it was an understandable mistake, though, and did read the update when he put it.
I thought giving Aramis Ramirez the Hank Aaron Award was bad...
I’ve got nothin’. This one is a jaw dropper.
It's pretty astounding.
I was almost expecting Yuni to win, honestly.
J.K.L.
by Aaron Campeau on Nov 6, 2008 1:27 AM EST up reply actions
He's better that Jeter!!!!111one
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by Matt Klaassen on Nov 6, 2008 12:12 PM EST up reply actions
One error
By staying away from the ball, there’s no chance of screwing it up.
Curt never met a buttered roll he didn't like.
Plus minus representations!
For the sake of something statty to look at, I put together lists of each league using plus/minus. They include the number reach winner put up at their respective positions (alone) and their MLB ranks at those positions. Then, for reference, is a list of the leaders at each position, along with their MLB ranks.
American League
Winners
Carlos Pena: +14 (5th)
Dustin Pedroia: +15 (5th)
Adrian Beltre: +32 (1st)
Michael Young: -7 (27th)
Torii Hunter: -5 (19th)
Grady Sizmore: +7 (10th)
Ichiro Suzuki: +3 [-9 CF (25th), +12 RF (7th)]
Leaders
1B: Carlos Pena, 14 (5th)*
2B: Mark Ellis, +26 (2nd)
3B: Adrian Beltre, +32 (1st)
SS: Mike Aviles, +15 (7th)
LF: Carl Crawford, +23 (1st)
CF: Carlos Gomez, +32 (1st)
RF: Franklin Gutierrez, 29 (1st)
*Kevin Youkilis was a +14 overall, with a +8 at third and a +6 at first.
+Alex Rios put up a +15 in RF (4th) and a +11 in CF (6th) for an overall +26.
But Pedroia
while my opinion may be a little skewed here, does make great plays sometimes.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
Well, sure.
Even the bad second basemen make great plays sometimes. Some of these guys just do it a lot. Imagine if you were able to watch one of them play on a regular basis!
Also, there can be only one winner in things like this. If a guy is number 2, that doesn’t mean he’s just as good as everyone between number 3 and number 30. It’s the relative difference in talent that matters, not who takes home the award.
Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.
Let me rephrase that
He makes great plays often.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
Pedroia is quite good.
Ellis is way better.
J.K.L.
by Aaron Campeau on Nov 9, 2008 1:49 AM EST up reply actions
Sadly
Gold Gloves are not solely on defense, offense is a factor too (see Derek, Jeter, and Young, Michael) and, of course, McLouth. Gold Gloves are closer to MVPs by position than actual defense.
Well, I'll appreciate for you to keep my zingers outta your mouth!
Excuse my lack of knowledge but where exactly do you find these plus/minus stats?
by The Big Hurt on Nov 11, 2008 9:24 PM EST up reply actions
Those exact +/- stats are from billjamesonline.com, a pay site.
… and it’s John Dewan’s +/- system. There are other defensive systems out there (although Dewan’s is pretty damn good). UZR (pre 2007 available only at tangotiger.net/mgl) and PMR (baseballmusings.com) are two other excellent ones. Another combined system can be found via the link to Justin’s stats in this article.
Maybe it’s time for another “What stats should I be using and where can I find them?” post…
Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.
No... let's just let it go through piecemeal, it's more fun that way
anyone else noticed that use using RZR/OOZ and converting it to runs/plays ends up a lot harder on players, in general, than the Dewan’s stats?
OMG Banny. FWIW I am only crdtng u w/3 runs allwd bc of DDJ OMFG
by Matt Klaassen on Nov 11, 2008 11:18 PM EST up reply actions
Harder?
Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.
by Sky Kalkman on Nov 11, 2008 11:21 PM EST up reply actions
National League
Winners
Adrian Gonzalez: -6 (25th)
Brandon Phillips: +17 (4th)
David Wright: +3 (13th)
Jimmy Rollins: +23 (1st)
Carlos Beltran: +24 (2nd)
Shane Victorino: +10 (7th)
Nate McLouth: -40 (35th)
Leaders
1B: Albert Pujols +20 (2nd)
2B: Chase Utley +47 (1st)
3B: Blake DeWitt +11 (7th)
SS: Jimmy Rollins +23 (1st)
CF: Carlos Beltran +24 (1st)
RF: Brian Giles +20 (2nd)
LF: Willie Harris +22 (2nd)*
Chris Young (23), Cody Ross (15) and Jody Gerut (+12) were all centerfielders with a higher contribution than Victorino.
*Harris was a +25 playing six different positions.
-40
is this the worst gold glove in history?
---
Juuuust a bit outside!!
http://balkingtraditionalism.blogspot.com/
Notice that none of the four BtB authors wrote anything about the Gold Gloves on the front page...
Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.
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